cognitive fun!

Learn your mind. Play it too.
2010 study shows no improvement on Raven's w/ training
Darren | 2 years ago Reply Link me
Okay, does the dual n back task really work, or is this just a publication bias
Superakiha | 2 years ago Reply
2010 study shows no improvement on Raven's w/ training
"These findings can be addressed from the more parsimonious view that CWM training affects reading comprehension in the same way that it benefits both WM (verbal and spatial) and Stroop performance: by enhancing a domain-general attentional mechanism not specifically tied to verbal or spatial storage per se, but to the coordination of information maintenance in the face of additional processing demands. This interpretation is consistent with the broader claim that CWM tasks are highly predictive of cognitive function specifically because they limit rehearsal and domain-specific strategy use and, hence, emphasize the role of domain-general attentional mechanisms (Cowan et al., 2005). Since verbal rehearsal strategies are so highly developed, the suppression of rehearsal and the isolation of attention control mechanisms may be more complete in spatial CWM span tasks (Conway et al., 2005). Accordingly, the inclusion of a spatial CWM component in training may have been especially important in producing the observed generalization effect. Indeed, our correlational findings suggest that reading comprehension improvements were particularly dependent on increased spatial WM performance."

"Admittedly, one difficulty for the claim that transfer arises from the impact of WM training on a domaingeneral attentional process is that both improved and unimproved measures included in our assessment battery have been linked, on the basis of latent variable studies, to this shared WM mechanism (Kane et al., 2004). The selectivity of transfer invites the question of why training generalized to some of the cognitive skills that we measured, but not to others. Specifically, the training group did not show differential improvement on measures of reasoning or fluid intelligence, which also putatively demand controlled attention. One way to address the apparent discrepancy is to assume that tasks for which we observed improvements simply place a higher demand on controlled attention than do the unaffected tasks. Another possibility is that our study lacked the statistical power to reveal modest training effects in seemingly unaffected measures. Indeed, there was a trend toward significance in the effect of training on the ETS reasoning composite that would likely have reached statistical significance in a larger sample."

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_7721/is_201004/ai_n53507996/pg_7/?tag=content;col1

I'd say the odds against Jaeggi etc. claim of enhanced iq are 2:1. However unlike the BBC study, Chein and Morrison conclude that there is enhancement of reading comprehension-meaning that dual n back training is probably worthwhile.
Darren | 2 years ago Reply
I personally have every reason I've ever seen to believe that reasoning and fluid intelligence correlate so strongly with working memory because people are more likely to develop both to a higher degree when they start out with having better working memories. I consider reasoning and most tests of fluid intelligence to be acquirable skills, admittedly attached in some way, loosely, to more biologically rooted capacities like working memory.

Thus it makes sense to me that improving working memory would enhance cognitive functioning that is tested in more fundamental and basic ways, but that it would not immediately nor necessarily ever enhance things like reasoning or fluid intelligence. I'm not sure how much the brain is able to develop after maturity, but if it is still quite flexible, then I don't see why a suddenly enhanced working memory capacity couldn't, with plenty of time, and regular exposure to tasks that for example challenge reasoning capacity, eventually result in enhanced reasoning capacity or fluid intelligence.
? | 1 year ago Reply
"I'd say the odds against Jaeggi etc. claim of enhanced iq are 2:1."
Why?
? | 2 years ago Reply
...Please read: "Beyond statistical explanations, differences in the training paradigms used for the two studies may explain the differences in transfer effects. The training program used by Jaeggi et al. (2008) involved 400 trials per training session, with a dual n-back training paradigm designed to emphasize binding processes and task management. Conversely, our training paradigm included only 32 trials per session and more heavily emphasized maintenance in the face of distraction." (next paragraph)

Perhaps the brain needs hundreds of repetitions in order to alter performance.

There are no odds against a valid study.
? | 2 years ago Reply
Jaeggi came up with the dual n back task in 2003(i think), under the premise of augmenting gF by improving working memory. Working memory explains much of the difference in IQ between people. The neural circuitry that underlies wm must overlap with gF.

Training wm in mice supposedly increases their g, so I suppose it is theoretically possible, even if gf increase is not proven fully in humans.

Dual n back, this game specifically, simply may be ineffective the way Sudoko(spllg?) is. Not taxing enough, or too primitive in design. However this doesn't mean that a wm and gF boosting game cannot exist.
Darren | 2 years ago Reply
I want to work with dnb exclusively and see for myself if it can boost my IQ.

I plan to train w/ dnb on Brainworkshope for 2hrs a day straight through, everyday for a month. I've taken reliable pretest iq exams and will retake them when Im done. Im on day 3.
Darren | 2 years ago Reply
I'm sure that we are all eagerly awaiting your report. I (like many others, I'm sure) have been waiting for some real quantitative evidence. On behalf of many, thank you for putting in the time and effort!

Cheers!
? | 2 years ago Reply
Speaking of hyperbole...
? | 2 years ago Reply
Cynicism is easy which is exactly why it's so common. :-/
? | 2 years ago Reply
Realism is so difficulty which is exactly why it's so uncommmon. :-\
? | 2 years ago Reply
"20 trained participants and in the subgroup of 15 "successfully" trained participants"

great paper.

result consistency seems emerging across well thought out practice.
medicalstudent | 2 years ago Reply
yawn.

and actually there are lots of people on here eager to hear of what others are doing w/ dnb
Darren | 2 years ago Reply
snore.
? | 2 years ago Reply
I've been increasing n at 30%, using Brainworkshop. I also practice 9-back here. Daily since end of March.
WT
? | 2 years ago Reply
Fart...
? | 2 years ago Reply
Buzz off, moron.
? | 2 years ago Reply
Buzz on, genius.
? | 2 years ago Reply

Login to save scores

© 2008-2009 cognitivefun.net | about | widgets | blog | cognitive neuroscience for everyone